tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4650356187241258926.post1934346609871601973..comments2023-05-06T02:30:27.042-07:00Comments on the lowercase blog: a ten-thousand-pound lidJoelhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/08855099445985126263noreply@blogger.comBlogger6125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4650356187241258926.post-6784732848709108012011-06-06T12:27:30.542-07:002011-06-06T12:27:30.542-07:00Okay! Back! I wrote an entire response about 3 day...Okay! Back! I wrote an entire response about 3 days ago only to have a load error and watch it all disappear. That pissed me off lol, anyways... Onward. I'll respond to you in the order that your challenges are presented.<br /><br />The Bible is the primary source about the life of Jesus Christ, the New Testament having been written by those who walked with him (with the exception of Paul who was still recorded as handpicked by Luke and commended by Peter). So if Jesus says He is God, and He instructs these men to record what He said and did for generations to come, I would think that it should be accurate. Essentially, if we trust Jesus, and Jesus trusts them, shouldn't we?<br /><br />That space is real, and I hope that He uses even these conversations begin filling it! And some good news to you, I have them too.<br /><br />Inspiration doesn't guarantee inerrancy? Good point, I haven't thoroughly considered that! I suppose I've always seen God's involvement as evidence of perfection, but now that I really think about it, if that were true, then you and I would be perfect, because He's certainly involved in our lives, huh? Haha, well played Joel! I'll have to dig deeper for that one!<br /><br />We are most certainly rap-watching art-destroying monkeys! (Although I'm burdened to say that not all rap is utterly devoid of truth or beauty) It would be foolish for a divine plan to need us to be figured out! You're right! That's why Jesus came though, isn't it? He laid out that divine plan in not so many words! He was the perfect revelation of God's will! (The Bible even says that!) If we can read the entire Bible through the scope of His words then we are simply more fully understanding that plan. It's like you and I living together for years and getting to know each other and then reading each others favorite books or favorite movies to understand each other that much more deeply.<br /><br />No problem about the misunderstanding bro. Hopefully one day we'll both be able to understand each other a little better.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4650356187241258926.post-76599720154365631842011-05-24T20:53:45.595-07:002011-05-24T20:53:45.595-07:00@michael: those are some great thoughts! i'll ...@michael: those are some great thoughts! i'll try to engage them the best i can.<br /><br />"...digging, maybe you will though." <br />- true, i would love to study this for years on end. a good friend spent his college years examining this topic, and we've chatted a lot about it. we could have a group skype chat sometime, if that sounds worthwhile... added to the list! i will check out that link : )<br /><br /><br />"I believe the Bible because the life and person of Jesus Christ is undeniably true."<br />- as you know from our conversations, i believe in the person of Jesus Christ also. is it the next logical step, then, to believe, in the abovementioned ways, in the bible?<br /><br />"I think that I'd be foolish to completely depend on my logic (which has got me in a lot of trouble over my lifetime) to correctly navigate every nook and cranny of what is or isn't true."<br />- this makes a lot of sense to me. believing it has created, whether real or simply mis-perceived, a deep need in me. i like to think of it in Hope-full terms, as a potential space for God.<br /><br />"If it was predicted for thousands of years through hundreds of prophecies (some of which are nearly impossible to fulfill)that God would come down and live among men, and one man came and fulfilled all of them, (Even dying and coming back to life!)I'm gonna listen to every word He says, He obviously knows more about life and death than I do!"<br />- are you defending the validity of the myth that God wrote the bible on the grounds that God wrote it? i don't disagree with you that the prophecies about Jesus came true, or even that God inspired them. but divine inspiration is not necessarily evidence for inerrancy.<br /><br />"I'd argue that whatever things have the greatest capacity for good in our world also have the greatest capacity for evil."<br />- maybe so. my argument is against the mythology surrounding the treatment of the text. the assumption of a divine plan that relies on human interpretation of a piece of literature to carry out the Kingdom seems ridiculous. we are obviously rap-watching and art-destroying monkeys.<br /><br />" strongly disagree, that's like saying that The US Constitution doesn't have a coherent moral structure because Supreme Court members often disagree on its interpretation, causing warring political parties, and spurring us keep on adding amendments to the Bill of Rights just to make it seem like there is a thread."<br />- i'm pretty sure my quote was taken out of context. i'm sorry i wasn't able to be clearer.<br /><br />i am so glad that yo wrote all of this. i'm looking forward to your responses, and to learning more about your perspective : )Joelhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08855099445985126263noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4650356187241258926.post-60668664191262587762011-05-23T00:47:41.227-07:002011-05-23T00:47:41.227-07:00"in a structure of belief that depends on the..."in a structure of belief that depends on the interpretation of the biblical morals as a basis for community, questions like mine were outside of the scope of discussion."<br />I'm sorry that you came up in a place like that, but the truth is that the communities Jesus demonstrated were just the opposite of that and many churches fail to realize it, you have my sympathy.<br /><br />"it was only after i left the church that i was able to take more seriously the observation that the biblical authors are saying radically different things. there actually didn't seem to be much of a continuous thread uniting them..."<br />Interesting claim, I'd like to see examples (and not just two scriptures compared outside of their context please).<br /><br />And Point #3- "there can be no cohesiveness of the biblical texts as a whole for the same reason that we have failed over the centuries to successfully extract a coherent moral structure from the these books."<br />I strongly disagree, that's like saying that The US Constitution doesn't have a coherent moral structure because Supreme Court members often disagree on its interpretation, causing warring political parties, and spurring us keep on adding amendments to the Bill of Rights just to make it seem like there is a thread.<br /><br />That's foolishness!<br /><br />We know that there is one! Even though each of the Founding Fathers had their own opinions and viewpoints, the documents themselves reflect a common unity of ideas. That's why we have to wrestle so hard to interpret them well. We all understand life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness; that much they all agreed on. But what do those things mean for children in low income housing? How about single mothers? Politicians? Immigrants? How about the wealthy?There are specific ways to apply those concepts in each of those situations, but since they weren't laid out to that specificity, we ask ourselves,"How would the founding fathers see this?" If there was no common thread or overarching truth, then we wouldn't even ask that question, right? Even though our answers may come out slightly differently and we may never agree, we should still find unity under the transcendent truths.<br /><br />It may be a weird thing to do, but I want to thank you for really making me think hard about this stuff, it's really a healthy thing for all of us to do. I look forward to your response (and I understand if it takes a while)!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4650356187241258926.post-3276598688888470002011-05-23T00:47:18.570-07:002011-05-23T00:47:18.570-07:00Hey, I want to wade in!
You were fairly general d...Hey, I want to wade in!<br /><br />You were fairly general during your critique of inerrancy, so I'll answer generally with the explanation of the whole canonization process that I once heard, read, and believe. (I'm sorry, but your mom's answer wasn't cutting it for me!): http://www.desiringgod.org/resource-library/seminars/why-we-believe-the-bible-part-1#WhichBooks<br /><br />I admit that I couldn't even begin to check the validity or accuracy of this explanation. I only accept it because it seems rational and I don't desire to invest that kind of time into really digging, maybe you will though.<br /><br />Point #2- It is my belief that any seeming contradiction in a biblical text can be reconciled reasonably. I cannot claim that I can or have worked through every one of them, but I have done so to a number of texts. I don't believe the Bible because everything in it makes sense to me; I believe the Bible because the life and person of Jesus Christ is undeniably true. I think that I'd be foolish to completely depend on my logic (which has got me in a lot of trouble over my lifetime) to correctly navigate every nook and cranny of what is or isn't true. If it was predicted for thousands of years through hundreds of prophecies (some of which are nearly impossible to fulfill)that God would come down and live among men, and one man came and fulfilled all of them, (Even dying and coming back to life!)I'm gonna listen to every word He says, He obviously knows more about life and death than I do!<br /><br />As far as all of the disagreements leading to schisms, wars, and other atrocities, I say this: You can give a monkey a 2 year old's doodle or a Da Vinci painting, and ultimately he's gonna tear them both up. The quality of the item cannot always be judged by the human response to it! Rappers Soulja Boi and Waka Flocka Flame are going to get more youtube views, have more sales, and ultimately be more popular than say, classical and jazz trumpeter Wynton Marsalis for reasons we may never truly know! Does that mean that they are better musicians or more artistic? Hell no! In fact, I'd argue that whatever things have the greatest capacity for good in our world also have the greatest capacity for evil.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4650356187241258926.post-41561018298585708092011-05-18T01:18:24.806-07:002011-05-18T01:18:24.806-07:00@grandpa: thank you so much for the prayers! : )@grandpa: thank you so much for the prayers! : )Joelhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08855099445985126263noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4650356187241258926.post-11088579174460782012011-05-15T22:28:22.923-07:002011-05-15T22:28:22.923-07:00Philippians 2:10. “So that at the name of Jesus,ev...Philippians 2:10. “So that at the name of Jesus,every knee shall bow, of those who are in heaven and on earth and under the earth, and every tongue shall confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.” I am praying that Jesus will reveal himself to you, like he did to Paul, and invite you bow before him to confess him as your Lord. “That if you confess with your mouth Jesus as Lord, and believe in you heart that God has raised him from the death, you will be saved.”Romans 10:10. John PylesAnonymousnoreply@blogger.com